Note: Transcript fully created by automated AI
[00:00:00] Jesse: Hi everyone. I’m Jesse Lin.
[00:00:02] Angela: And I’m Angela Lin, welcome back to another episode of, but where are you really from today? We have an interesting topic, at least for us, hopefully for you too. We wanna talk about. Our names or in general, the topic of having kind of two or more names, potentially. If you are from multiple cultures, what goes into coming up with those names?
[00:00:29] Angela: What potential baggage do we carry? Because we have multiple names and everything else to do with that topic. Um, so. As we’ve said many times throughout this podcast, we are both Taiwanese American. so outside of our English, Western names of Angela and Jesse, we also have Chinese names, which we used plenty growing up, especially because we went to Chinese school every Sunday and to write and go by those names.
[00:01:03] Angela: Um, so I think we were kicking this off by sharing what our Chinese names are, um, and kind of how we. About that, about having them. So my Chinese name is Ling. We, what about you, Jesse?
[00:01:20] Jesse: Mine’s Ling. J.
[00:01:23] Angela: All right. So what did you think about having a Chinese name growing up? Because was like, was it weird to share that name for you?
[00:01:36] Angela: to other people in any context specifically, or, or was it just like whatever? I have two
[00:01:41] Jesse: names. I think it definitely depended on who you were talking to. So if you were talking to like your mom’s friend, like an Asian auntie or anyone else who spoke Mandarin, or, you know, primarily you were gonna be talking to the mid Mandarin, it wasn’t as weird because that’s kind of like, it’s almost like your default, like your default name is that when you’re speaking in Mandarin, But then when you were like, I mean, we’ve like talked about this before, like when you’re in school in other situations where people are like, oh yeah, like what’s really your name.
[00:02:13] Jesse: Or like, um, can you, can you tell me your Mandarin? It’s like a little bit weird because it’s like, The closest thing that I, I can approximate it to would be like meeting a person and being like, oh, what’s your Christian name? is this like a weird thing to just like randomly ask somebody? Yeah. So yeah, that’s that’s those are the situations where I’ve been like, oh, like, why do you wanna know?
[00:02:36] Jesse: I, I can tell you, but it’s like a little bit strange. And plus like it doesn. Mean anything to it doesn’t even like, I don’t even know necessarily the meaning of my name. So I’m like, if it doesn’t mean anything to me, it doesn’t mean anything to you. So yeah, there were definitely like those situations where people were just kind of like asking randomly, I would be like, why do you wanna know?
[00:02:55] Jesse: It’s a little bit strange. Yeah. What about you?
[00:02:58] Angela: Yeah, same. I think it definitely was just kind of normal. If the person you were talking to was already speaking to in Chinese, because even though. Okay. So you kind of mentioned that, like, what’s your real name thing, and it is like triggering. I think when someone asks you what your real name is after you’ve given the, you know, the English name that you definitely go by.
[00:03:18] Angela: But I think there is this other kind of like flip side with. which is that if someone is speaking to you in Chinese, you’re like, quote, unquote, real name is your Chinese name. You’re like, they don’t wanna know your English name. Right. So mm-hmm, um, it’s like in that context, it’s your quote unquote real name, but yeah, when someone.
[00:03:37] Angela: non-Chinese speaking asks for that. I always found, like, it felt like we were like dancing monkeys or something, you know, they’re like, Ooh, tell me, you’re like, do the thing. Tell me the thing. Yeah. And it’s like, shut up also. It’s like, why am I even telling you you’re gonna Cher it. You can’t speak Chinese.
[00:03:54] Angela: Like there’s yeah. Chinese pronunciation is really hard. So it’s like, you’re not gonna say it. Right. And it’s weird. I never enjoyed it. When someone would ask me what that was. Um, you mentioned that you didn’t even necessarily know what your name meant and I definitely didn’t know. I think I swear to God.
[00:04:16] Angela: I think one time during Chinese school, they did make us like look up what our names meant and like maybe present it in class or something. But that was so long ago. I definitely don’t re I didn’t remember it. So we. Respectively asked our parents. what our names mean, um, recently, and that’s kind of how we knew it in this most recent time.
[00:04:43] Angela: So, Jessie, what did you find out about your name?
[00:04:48] Jesse: Oh, I feel like they didn’t really explain it that well, like in terms of what it actually means, but what they did explain was when drawing the name. So they told me that there are like these elements that, um, every person is born with something like. Fire or, you know, your regular or something elements.
[00:05:09] Jesse: Yeah. And when you’re born, you go to a person who basically calculates, it’s kind of like astrology a little bit or numerology, something like that. And they calculate based off of the date and time you were born, like what properties of different elements you have. and then they create your name to balance you out where you are deficient or like, I hate the word overindexing, but it’s like the best word, like deficient or overindexing in a specific element.
[00:05:44] Jesse: And then like, that’s how they, that’s how they draw your name.
[00:05:47] Angela: Okay. So my dad actually told me the exact same thing, but he was talking about it more in like his generation. He said it was more common that people kind of named their kids to make up for the lack of a certain element. And, and I let’s just say what this elements are.
[00:06:03] Angela: I think it’s, um, my dad told me it was gold. AKA metal fire, water earth, and hold on wood or something. Oh yeah. And wood. Yeah. Yeah. But then he said, . Yeah, like if you were deficient like one or two of them, then they’d use that word in some way in your name, whether it was like literally that word or, you know, in Chinese, there are a lot of characters that are kinda like combo words that have, like, you could include the word gold in it, but like add a thing on the right or bottom or whatever, and it becomes something else.
[00:06:38] Angela: But your name doesn’t have any specific elements. What is,
[00:06:42] Jesse: I mean, the middle character of my name is ho home. Yeah. It could be interpreted as home. So maybe I’m not, I lack, um, a home element
[00:06:53] Angela: earth, like, is that
[00:06:55] Jesse: supposed to be earth? Uh, well, theme is. SHA. I mean, it’s a family. Name’s also, yeah. That’s your family name?
[00:07:00] Jesse: Yeah, that that’s okay. Okay. Um, I don’t know. I honestly, like I asked them and I don’t think that they really understood how it was picked. They just kind of like described kind of the world of what was happening when the name selection occurs. But it is actually one of the things that is common when you’re introducing your.
[00:07:20] Jesse: Chinese name to other Chinese people is you’ll be like, oh, you know, my name’s DJA Shaul. And then you’ll like, explain what the character looks like. There have so many characters sound exactly the same mm-hmm , which is I think very interesting and different from how you would introduce like, An English name.
[00:07:36] Jesse: Like you would never be like my name’s, you know, Jesse with Y some people do that, but I don’t feel like a lot of people do that. You just say like my name’s Jesse or my name’s, whatever. It’s not
[00:07:46] Angela: as common. It’s not as common unless you’re spelled in like a weird way. Yeah. I think that’s something difficult to wrap your head around.
[00:07:54] Angela: If you don’t speak. I, I assume that other Asian languages have kind of similar stuff because there’s, um, similar pronunciations for many different words, but yeah, it is, it is kind of funny. Like they always, you are supposed to like, explain how your name is written when you spell, like yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, and then I guess like, I mean, because we are we’re first gen, so we’re not as good at Chinese as, uh, you know, native born folks.
[00:08:20] Angela: But I guess they, like, if you explain which word it is, they kind of already know what it means a little bit too. Um, without having to look it up, which is kind of weird, but, um, yeah, so my name, I went through an extensive, I asked extensively about my name, first of all, apparently. Uh, I don’t know about yours.
[00:08:43] Angela: It sounds like you just had, like, I think you had a fortune teller, cuz that’s what my dad called those people, even though they did what you said and you called them astrologers or whatever. But, um, he said that. We, they had like multiple names options for both me and my brother. I don’t know about you.
[00:09:02] Angela: Like, was it just like, do you know if there were like a bunch and then they just like chose one or they were like, this is his name deal with it? No, I
[00:09:09] Jesse: think, I think there were a few options and then they let the parents pick, like which option they liked the most.
[00:09:15] Angela: Okay. Yeah. So same with my brother. Um, because apparently.
[00:09:21] Angela: They, I didn’t have a fortune teller involved in my name choosing because I was born in America. Um, so I guess it was not really a thing as opposed to my brother who was born in Taiwan and he’s the first born. So it was like a big deal. Um, so they definitely went to fortune teller, but my dad told me that originally for my brother, he chose, he like spent a lot of time choosing 10.
[00:09:47] Angela: Philosophy inspired names. Cuz my dad is like super into philosophy and he thought it would be like a good tribute or whatever. And then they presented 10 different names to my mom’s dad. And he was like, I don’t like these. So then, so then they were forced to go to a fortune teller to find alts, um, and then presented those to the grandpa again.
[00:10:12] Angela: And he was like, okay, these are good. so I chose one of those. Um, but for me, my mom just chose. ’em like, I guess she came up with a bunch of potential names. Um, but just kind of on her own of, I guess, quality she was looking for in her child. Um, and also, I don’t know if your parents told you this, but, um, The names aren’t chosen until after you’re born already, because it does factor
[00:10:38] Jesse: in, you need the, you need the, you need the, the date and the time
[00:10:41] Angela: of the child before.
[00:10:42] Angela: Yeah. So like, I, I think that’s pretty different from the us because, you know, yeah. You usually come up with like a million names ahead of time and then they’re born and you’re like, you look like a Rebecca, like you Rebecca now. Yeah. Yeah. but it’s always from where you’re like, it’s from your shortlist usually.
[00:10:59] Angela: Um, yeah. Whereas you’re just like nameless until until you’re born. If you’re Chinese, I guess. Um, so my mom and dad said that when is just like, I don’t know, it encomp, it encompasses all the, like. Quote, unquote, good qualities attached to females. So things like warmth and elegance and blah, blah, blah. And then Z is like beautiful and like outwardly whatever.
[00:11:31] Angela: I was like,
[00:11:33] Jesse: I’m not. So they gave you like a girly girl name, basically
[00:11:35] Angela: super girly girl name, super like posh girl name.
[00:11:40] Jesse: Lady Angela.
[00:11:42] Angela: I know. I’m like, I’m not sure you chose wisely. You . Well, that’s what my name means.
[00:11:49] Jesse: yeah. I don’t think that really worked for you. You were like a tomboy for a
[00:11:52] Angela: while. I mean, I still am.
[00:11:55] Angela: I still am.
[00:11:55] Jesse: Okay. Yeah, but it was like more, I feel like in the nineties being a tomboy was more like, I’m here, I’m a tomboy versus now everyone’s kind of like, okay. Like gender, whatever. Yeah. Blah, blah, blah. It’s. It’s less of a, a big deal. But, um, that’s really interesting because what my parents told me, so first of all, they probably don’t really know what my name means because they didn’t pick it themselves, but they did tell me they were like, you can tell when someone has a name that hasn’t been selected by a fortune teller, cuz it sounds weird.
[00:12:24] Jesse: And I was like, what does that mean? Like they, they couldn’t like explain it, but they were like, it just doesn’t sound like a, a. Uh, nor I’ll regulate kind of like what you were saying when your dad brought like the names to your grandpa over grandpa. Um, and he was like, no, I don’t like these. I feel like there’s this somehow, you know, like there are so many of those things, whereas your parents are just like, oh no, that’s not it.
[00:12:46] Jesse: And you’re like, but why? Yeah. They, they can’t explain it. They’re just like, oh, it’s not it. And I, and, and, and, and you just don’t understand why. And, and they told me that they were like, you can tell when people’s names, aren’t selected by a fortune teller. And they’re like, they were like your grandmother, like my dad’s mom.
[00:13:03] Jesse: Her name wasn’t selected by a fortune teller. It’s only two characters and it sounds weird. And I, and they didn’t really give me a good explanation about why it sounds weird, but then I was like poking on them. I was like, okay. So if you didn’t get a fortune teller to give you a name, how did you pick the name?
[00:13:20] Jesse: and it’s the same way that your parents do? They’re like, oh, they just like picked whatever name. And they picked things that like were like either happenstance or like reminded them of something when the child was born. So it would be like if the child was born under a big moon, it would be like big moon.
[00:13:37] Jesse: Or like if they were born in the spring and there was like lavender, it would be like lavender. So it it’s like, it was very much. Like Vivian kind of situation. Yeah. And they actually told me that, um, the fortune telling thing has gone more popular recently. It’s like, not, it wasn’t really a thing back in the day, which I guess makes sense as I’m like.
[00:13:57] Jesse: I mean, like, I think our parents are like a little bit different in terms of like economic class where they’re coming from from Taiwan. But like, I feel like my, I don’t know, I don’t know. I’ve never seen your, your Taiwan home. Um, but they. Basically, they were like, nobody had money to, to pay for that oh, so they were like, yeah.
[00:14:17] Jesse: In, in the old days, like you would just name your child’s whatever. Um, and one of the things they brought up was, um, a lot of times, because you can’t be named until you’re born. Right. Mm-hmm because you have to the numerology or whatever, but a lot of the times they didn’t name them in the olden days because they didn’t know if the baby would survive.
[00:14:34] Jesse: So you would just have like, baby. As the name for a while until, until, until you were sure. Like, okay, this baby is like gonna not die. And then you would give them
[00:14:43] Angela: a name. Do yeah. Yeah. Related. I know I’ve mentioned that like parents, parents are human card game that I played with my family, um, a couple times, but, um, I don’t know which, which.
[00:14:57] Angela: Question brought about this, but I learned shit about my parents, that I was like, what? Um, but my mom said that she had a younger sibling die when they were an infant and they just, I remember you told me that froze to death.
[00:15:09] Jesse: I was like, what? I mean, I, we, like, I feel like we really forget, like our parents came from like, not even the ghetto, it’s not the ghetto.
[00:15:17] Jesse: It’s like the, the third world. the third world. There’s no,
[00:15:21] Angela: they’ve advanced a better way. Not Taiwan’s Aren, a third world country guys
[00:15:24] Jesse: just say not anymore night more, but it was rough for a while I think. Um, yeah. But yeah, I, and I asked them like a lot of questions about it, cause I was like, okay, so. Like what happens when you have a child and you don’t name them and they pass, like, how do you honor the child?
[00:15:39] Jesse: Cause they have no name. Mm-hmm or like, what if you have a miscarriage, like baby’s not born, you can’t give them a name then they’re just kinda like, it just kind of is what it is. Like they just don’t have a name rough. And I was like, okay. They’re like it, they only, you only get a name if you’ve like lived for duration of time.
[00:15:56] Jesse: Otherwise they, they don’t usually, they don’t typically like name the baby. After it’s passed.
[00:16:02] Angela: I mean, I guess it’s easier to not get so attached, I guess. Mm-hmm yeah. If there’s no name, that’s sad. That’s just sad.
[00:16:10] Jesse: But I, I think it is, I mean, it shows how powerful and significant like naming yeah. Is. Um, because it’s tied to so many of these things like of a person living and being like a viable individual and also like your attachment to them.
[00:16:25] Jesse: Because I, because, you know, if you don’t have a name to what you’re saying, it’s E I think it’s easier. Like. Not so much easier, but maybe a little bit easier for you not to be attached because it’s just kind of like, oh, this nameless individualist child. Yeah, yeah,
[00:16:41] Angela: yeah. Actually, uh, related, but sidetrack, um, Chrissy, Tegan, I follow her and John legend.
[00:16:48] Angela: Um, but a couple months back she had a miscarriage, like really close to. Um, like she was almost a term and then they lost the baby or maybe it was a stillborn or something like that. Um, and she wrote a really vulnerable post about how they, like, she cuz they already have two kids. Um, and she was like, oh we didn’t name like these kids until they were born.
[00:17:09] Angela: Like, I’m sure they had the shortlist, like, you know, most American people do, but she was like, oh it was with. Third child. They kind of like broke that rule and did name him before he was born. And she mentioned that it was like so much harder because they had already grown this like strong attachment to him because they had named him.
[00:17:30] Angela: Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah. It’s sad.
[00:17:33] Jesse: Yeah. I mean, it’s a powerful thing and it’s probably why, you know, parents will go to fortune tellers to, um, to get that done so that you have like the most auspicious. Name and like luckiness. Well, not me
[00:17:46] Angela: bro. I’m
[00:17:49] Jesse: American. It’s it’s fine. Honestly, like, yeah, it’s, it’s a little bit weird because I don’t exactly know how they’re doing.
[00:17:57] Jesse: They told me there’s like this giant book where like they look at the book and the dates and the times, and then they like pull out the name options, but it sounds like a little bit weird. I’m like, how can you have a book that has like every date ever.
[00:18:12] Angela: Hey, everyone. We love doing this podcast. And if you enjoy our episodes, we would really appreciate if you could support us in any number of ways.
[00:18:22] Angela: First is by subscribing to us, rating us and reviewing us on apple podcasts and iTunes. Second is by telling a friend third is follow us on Instagram at where are you from? Fourth is supporting us on Mia coffee. You can find out more about all of these by visiting our Instagram’s Lincoln bio. And again, our handle is at where are you from?
[00:18:46] Angela: Pod. Thank you. Well, how about less complex names? We also obviously have English names. Do you know how your parents named you Jessica?
[00:18:58] Jesse: Oh, yeah, it’s so funny because I was asking them this and my mom told me the exact same story that I told everyone. And my, my dad told me like a completely different story.
[00:19:05] Jesse: And my mom was like, no, that’s not correct. what it’s. So, first of all, like, Let me I’ll backtrack a little bit. I asked him like, who picked my Chinese name? And like how, um, traditionally, like, who gets the say mm-hmm and my mom was like, I picked it mm-hmm and I was like, oh, I asked my dad, I was like, didn’t you pick it?
[00:19:27] Jesse: Like, I’m like your only progeny. He’s like, no, your mom picked it. And I was like, okay, work, work. Um, so I guess there’s no like really rigid structure there. I don’t know, country people. Um, and then with my English name, it was John Stamos character on full house uncle Jesse. Yeah, because when my mom immigrated here to the states, it was one of the shows that she would watch all the time.
[00:19:53] Jesse: And it’s like, it’s a family show with lots of laugh tracks and kids. So it’s like, even if you don’t understand English, you can still kind of like relate to it. Mm-hmm so that’s how she said, she said. She got the idea from that character. I think she said she looked in like an English name book to see like, what that name meant.
[00:20:13] Jesse: And then she was like, oh, like, it looks fine. And it’s not very typical. And she was like, she was like, yeah, I didn’t wanna name you like a John or like an Alex or like, uh, David, like everyone already has those names. And I was like, okay, like, I guess you did do your research when you were naming me. so
[00:20:29] Angela: the, the dad or mom naming you thing.
[00:20:32] Angela: interesting that they didn’t care. Cuz my mom, she didn’t make a big deal about it. But when I ask her about like, who named me, who, who named my brother or whatever, my dad named my brother, I mean, he was the one who came up with like the first batch of rejected names. And I’m guessing he chose from the fortune to names.
[00:20:51] Angela: Um, But when she said that she came up with my name and all the options, she was like, blah, blah, blah. I came up with your name, which is kind of weird, cuz that should have been your dad’s job and like kept going. And I was like, okay. So I think there might, I think the default might be that the dad usually chooses the name, but just like didn’t necessarily.
[00:21:14] Angela: Go that way for either of us.
[00:21:16] Jesse: I mean, let’s be real. Our moms wear the pants in the real , she’s just,
[00:21:22] Angela: they are strong, strong characters. They are
[00:21:24] Jesse: strong female figures, although they fit within the very traditional female. Yeah. The. Stereotype. Uh, but they know they, they make a lot of the decisions in our family, so,
[00:21:35] Angela: yes.
[00:21:36] Angela: Yeah. Um, my name is super similar to yours. It also was just from a sitcom, but okay. So when I was wait, wait, which sitcom. Okay. I don’t know because when I was growing up, I asked my mom. A long time ago. I asked my mom where’d you come with Angela? And she was like, it’s from three’s company. And then I just like brush it off.
[00:21:54] Angela: And then I think like a little later I looked up the cast of three’s company. I was like, there is no Angela,
[00:22:00] Jesse: no show what? There’s no character or nobody. There’s no
[00:22:04] Angela: caster named Angela. And then, um, Like when I asked her in prep for this episode, I was like, you told me it was three’s company, but there was no Angela character in that show.
[00:22:15] Angela: She was like, what’s three’s company. She was like, whatever she was like, I don’t remember what show it was, but it was some show I liked,
[00:22:23] Jesse: oh my God.
[00:22:24] Angela: Very similar to how they named my Chinese name. She was like, oh, I just thought she was pretty. So I gave you that name. Oh my gosh. That’s so funny. Like, okay.
[00:22:34] Jesse: I do.
[00:22:34] Jesse: I do like that, like kind of the duality of it, which is like, we have put so much significance into your like Chinese name and then English name is just like, oh, I just like this. that’s cool.
[00:22:47] Angela: Sounds good.
[00:22:48] Jesse: yeah, whatever. It’s good. It’s fine. I mean it, and it does, it does lend the whole Koreans to like Asian name is the real name.
[00:22:55] Jesse: Cause they don’t really care
[00:22:56] Angela: about that. Yeah. For them English name, right? Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Yeah. Okay. Well, so neither of us, we both have English and Chinese names, but neither of us have our Chinese names as our like middle names. Um, Did you ever think about that? Or did that affect you in any way growing
[00:23:14] Jesse: up?
[00:23:14] Jesse: I don’t think I really thought about it until I encountered somebody who did have like a phonetically translated Asian name as, as their, as their English name. And I think the reason for that is for me, I feel like there’s always this divide, like at home, that’s my name. And then in the class, Elementary school, whatever my name was always Jesse.
[00:23:39] Jesse: So there was never a mix really. Um, and so I never thought about that. It was weird until I felt until people started asking. Like, oh, is it like, is your real, because cuz then you start, as you get older, you start encountering people who do have, um, translated, uh, translated Chinese names as their English names.
[00:23:59] Jesse: And then people start asking cuz then they assume that your name is not. Whatever it is. And it’s in fact, you, because a lot of people have the translated names, but then they’ll like, oh my name’s Anna or something like that, it’s just not legal. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, so then people start assuming that because you are, you look like them, you also have the same kind of name structure where my name’s Jesse, but legally it says, and I didn’t really, I don’t think, I don’t remember as a kid thinking that it was like weird or anything until people started like really pointing it out.
[00:24:28] Jesse: Mm. What about
[00:24:29] Angela: you? It was directly something I thought about because my brother has his name, his Chinese name as his middle name, but I don’t have my Chinese name as my middle name. And I didn’t ask my parents about this, but if I had to guess it was just like, You know, he came from Taiwan, like he was born in Taiwan and then they, yeah, they just were like, that’s your name?
[00:24:48] Angela: So it’s part of your English name too versus I was born here and then they didn’t do the fortune tell thing. So they probably were just like, keep the American name separate from the Chinese name. If, if I had to guess. Um, and I definitely paid attention to that growing up because I was always really happy that I didn’t have my Chinese name in there.
[00:25:09] Angela: Mm-hmm and I always kind of like made fun of my brother for having this Chinese name in there. And I mean, obviously what we talk about a lot on the show is like, we didn’t. Being Asian growing up, we didn’t wanna be different. And so for me, it was definitely like how much more alienated can you be than to have a name that people can’t pronounce as your like actual official name?
[00:25:36] Angela: so like, I was always really proud when people, people would always ask. Yeah, like, what’s your Chinese name? And then, or they’d be like, what’s your middle name? And I’d be like, I don’t have a middle name. And they’re like, really? It’s not your Chinese name. I’m like, nah, bitch, it’s blank. There’s no middle name.
[00:25:53] Angela: Um, and I’d be really like, Proud of that fact, because I felt like I was defending my Americanness or like my right to be one of everyone else, you know? Um, and the only place where my Chinese name existed was yeah. In the spaces of like Chinese school or like family, friends, whatever, and also on my Taiwanese passport.
[00:26:17] Angela: Um, but they always, it was separate. It was never, it was not like Angela. Once in Lin, you know, it was like they once alias, Angela Lin on, on the passport.
[00:26:27] Jesse: So you, so your brother’s name is Johnny. His actual name, like the two characters of his name? Yeah. And then his laws name. Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. I, sometimes I think about that and I’m like, cuz you were born here right in the states.
[00:26:40] Jesse: Mm-hmm and I, I always think like people make mistakes because like you have the baby and then they’re like right out the marriage certificate and just push out a baby. So I’m like, I could see a situation where you just completely forgot the middle name cuz you’re like, uh .
[00:26:54] Angela: Well, actually that’s a really good point.
[00:26:56] Angela: They probably didn’t come up with my Chinese name. In time for that. Oh
[00:27:02] Jesse: yeah. Yeah, exactly. So they probably couldn’t even, but
[00:27:05] Angela: then my mom randomly watched a show that had the name Angela in it before I was born. I don’t know. Who
[00:27:09] Jesse: knows. well, like maybe they, they realized that they needed to register your English name, but they still couldn’t pump out like, well, but you yours wasn’t they didn’t, they didn’t go to a fortune to for, so they,
[00:27:21] Angela: no, I, I think I was still named after I was born cuz she oh, okay.
[00:27:25] Angela: Because she, she said like, oh, I chose, I chose. Which means beautiful because I thought you were a beautiful baby. So it was after I was born.
[00:27:36] Jesse: which you chosen something else? If you were an ugly baby?
[00:27:38] Angela: Yeah, probably wisdom. Like, I don’t know,
[00:27:42] Jesse: probably something. Oh, my gosh.
[00:27:45] Angela: No, they would’ve focused on some other non-duty related
[00:27:50] Jesse: word.
[00:27:51] Jesse: I’m sure. But I mean, I think you do, like, I feel like our, our stories dovetail, because, and, and also like I’m thinking about. When we had your brother on mm-hmm and he was talking about the school that he first went to the integrated school that he first went to. When he came here, it is very much people making us uncomfortable.
[00:28:09] Jesse: Mm-hmm about the names that you actually start to notice it because as a kid, like, like little kids don’t tease you for that, because like, it doesn’t matter to them, but I think as you get older, Um, people start to like separate out and they start to like group people mm-hmm and try to like define things.
[00:28:26] Jesse: And then that’s when you become very aware that like, oh, like my name is different. Mm-hmm not because it’s not English, but because people think of the English name as like a secondary name and they think of the, um, Chinese name as, as the primary. Name, and that’s when it starts to like actually formulate in your head that it’s like a little bit weird and you really start to see it because I don’t really remember having that experience at all until people started saying stuff about it.
[00:28:54] Angela: Yeah. Actually. And now that I’m thinking back on it, I think before, like you said, kids don’t know to like, make fun of. Kids for certain reasons until a certain age. Um, yeah. And I think until that point, I did think it was like cool to have two names. Like I think I remember thinking it was kind of special that we had two names, whereas everyone else had like one name.
[00:29:16] Angela: Um, it was almost like as. Secret that no one else had, um, besides us until then it was, yeah, exactly what you said. It was like, no, but Angela’s not your real name. What’s your real name because you’re Asian. So you must have like a different name and it’s like, fuck
[00:29:32] Jesse: you. . Yeah. Yeah. But it’s good. I feel like it’s good to, um, you like talking about it to reclaim it.
[00:29:39] Jesse: Like it is my.
[00:29:41] Angela: Yeah. Mm-hmm yeah. Mm-hmm even if I forget how to write it, sometimes wait, are you serious? We’ve talked about this. My name is way more complex
[00:29:49] Jesse: than yours. Oh, I actually forgetting what your name looks like. Yeah, mine is. Oh, and that, that that’s that’s a good point. My mom also said she picked it cuz it was easy to write.
[00:30:00] Jesse: She’s like easy to write. I wanted it to be easy for you. I know she knew, she knew I was gonna become a, um, what what’s the a non-Asian Asian me.
[00:30:11] Angela: Yeah, no mine. Mine’s pretty complex. There are a lot of strokes in my. my name? Um, no, but the, the joke is that, like, we went to Chinese school every year till we were graduated high school.
[00:30:23] Angela: Um, but we always had summers off. So like in the summers we didn’t do shit with Chinese. Right. Like besides like talking to our parents or whatever in Chinese mm-hmm but like writing and reading. Nah. So then the, I, I remember there was one year I like came back from summer vacation and the first day of Chinese school, you know, you’d write your name on like every assignment and.
[00:30:43] Angela: Fuck.
[00:30:44] Jesse: You’re
[00:30:44] Angela: like, whoa, I think I got it right. But I was like hesitating.
[00:30:49] Jesse: Oh my gosh. Damn. Oh my gosh. Rough. I mean, my mom picked correct, because it is very easy for
[00:30:55] Angela: me to write my name. Yeah. Try to write my name, bitch. You can’t it’s too hard. I
[00:31:00] Jesse: can write your family name. Well,
[00:31:02] Angela: that’s get let’s for that.
[00:31:04] Angela: Let’s get into that family name. So we have stated this several times, but although our last names are both Lin, we are not related with that said all Chinese people are related, you know, at some point, if you go far back enough, but, um, we wanted to talk about where the lens came from. And then I specifically asked my dad like, cuz you remember when we had Catherine and mark on and they talked about how.
[00:31:35] Angela: You ask, like, when, you know, someone’s Korean last name, you ask which clan they’re from. And it’s like a whole thing to kinda like trace that back to, I guess, to make sure you’re not blood related. If you have like the same. Last name. Um, but I asked my dad if he knew, like, which clan we were from and he, he like gave me some, some facts, but he was like, yes, yes, you can trace that back.
[00:32:01] Angela: But I don’t know, like all the details off the top of my head, he gave me some things, but, um, Hmm. Did you ask your parents about where our family name came from?
[00:32:09] Jesse: Um, my dad said he doesn’t like, know where in China they came from, but he said that if you wanted to find out, you could basically mm-hmm . So he said that when, when the family moved over, they brought with them like a family tree.
[00:32:26] Jesse: Yes. Or something like that. And it’s like enshrined in like a Lin family temple. Yes. And if you want and you could go to the temple. And look at the family tree. Yay. And I was like, I was like, where is this family tree? I wanna go see it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I’m like, you’ve never shown it to me. Am I on it?
[00:32:44] Jesse: Like, yeah. Yeah. So that’s what he told me. He doesn’t like know exactly, but he was like, we, we could go back cuz I was asking him like, do you know if we have family members. Back in China, because like at some point we, the family immigrated to Taiwan. Mm-hmm even if it was like a couple hundred years ago, it’s reasonable to assume that there might still be folks back in China.
[00:33:04] Jesse: And he was like, well, you would have to look at the family tree and see like, you know, who’s on it. And I’m like, okay, well, I’ve never seen this mythical family tree or, and I don’t know where the Lin family, I didn’t even know we had a family temple. I was like, where is
[00:33:19] Angela: it? Yeah. Yeah. My dad said the exact same thing.
[00:33:23] Angela: Um, it’s interesting because he, I think my dad mentioned two temples because his. His family temple that is in Taiwan. He mentioned that a while ago to me, which like I was like, okay, so I knew that existed, but then he mentioned there was a different temple that has this family tree back in China. And he said that our family is from, uh, the hun and province.
[00:33:51] Angela: And okay. Uh, specifically, I guess the hometown is GU Guang Jo area. Oh, okay. Um, so that’s where we’re from, I guess it’s thousands of years ago. Um, but did, did your parents tell you, he told me the like myth of where, like the lens, like the OG Lin came from. Did your parents tell you that?
[00:34:16] Jesse: No, I did look it up on the, I have the Wikipedia open though with the, oh, yours is probably more
[00:34:20] Angela: accurate than my dad was like going off his memory.
[00:34:24] Angela: Wanna tell it?
[00:34:24] Jesse: Oh, I don’t. It’s a long story. Oh, it’s a really long story. It’s just like, it’s, uh, you know, if you guys are familiar with like the war in kingdoms era and like all that stuff in China, it’s like, it’s almost like K drama level, like K drama level pettiness, but like IL people fighting to control China.
[00:34:46] Jesse: I mean, you could probably tell your story’s probably better. This one’s very. Very very long, but, um, it does say that the distribution of the surname, Lin second, most common surname in Fuen fourth, most common in the city of ha HaCo, HaCo. I don’t know. That’s how it’s written English and 10th, most common in the city of GUSO.
[00:35:07] Jesse: Okay.
[00:35:08] Angela: Okay. My dad told me the myth, the legend. Um, so it is from like a million years ago. It’s uh, from, he guessed, it was like between 1500 and 2000 BCE was the first ancestor whose name was beacon? Apparently. Um, but it’s a, it’s a whole long story, but basically he was like the uncle of the emperor.
[00:35:32] Angela: There’s some like, BS about like, prove your loyalty to me. He got killed. So then his family was like gonna get taken by the soldiers and then his wife who was pregnant, ran away from them and ran to hide in the woods and then gave birth to their child in the woods. And Lin is written as two tree characters side by side, essentially.
[00:35:58] Angela: So that is where Lin came from is the fact that this child of the first ancestor was born in the forest. So. I really gave you the like cliff notes. He gave me a really long story, but that, yeah, this is
[00:36:12] Jesse: a, this is, this is a, I bet good cliff notes version of the origins story on Wikipedia. Yeah.
[00:36:18] Angela: Um, so yeah, that’s where it came from.
[00:36:21] Angela: Um, so it’s funny because I thought Lin was like, Super fucking common because of, I mean, I seem that way. It seems that way because where we grew up. So we grew up in Irvine, which in the nineties, in orange county, California, um, was like, if you was a Chinese person, you know, Chinese speaking person, they were from Taiwan.
[00:36:40] Angela: Like everyone was from Taiwan. I, I think I knew like one mainland Chinese family, most people were Taiwanese, um, who immigrated. And so my dad told me, so yeah, he guessed 17th in China, but you said it’s 18th. Um, top three names. I looked this up, um, top three last names in China are Wong because it means emperor.
[00:37:00] Angela: So everyone wants to be fucking royalty. So that’s number one, Lee. And then John are the top three. and Lin’s like super far down, but he said in Taiwan, there is a saying, he said, it’s Chan Ling mania, AKA everyone last name’s arch and Ling everyone. And their mom has those two last names. So I guess Taiwan it’s like the number two, one or two, you know, um, Top last name.
[00:37:31] Angela: So it makes sense that for us only knowing Taiwanese people growing up, um, we had Lin kind of everywhere
[00:37:40] Jesse: and you know what, it probably also like dovetails with just the fact of like, who like patterns of migration, cuz it’s like, um, I’m fairly certain that the family is probably from like Fu gen province.
[00:37:50] Jesse: Mm-hmm . And so like, I would assume that probably. And it’s close to Taiwan, geographically. Yeah. From China. So I would assume that only, only certain people were able to immigrate because like, how are you gonna immigrate? Like from the Northwest of China to Taiwan, that’s like so far, like it, you know, a couple hundred years ago, it’s like really far yeah.
[00:38:09] Jesse: For a family to travel. So, or I’m not surprised that it’s only like a few family names.
[00:38:14] Angela: Look, I don’t know, man. There are Koreans in Argentina just saying .
[00:38:18] Jesse: Well, that’s a different thing. they were specifically specifically brought there. Oh,
[00:38:24] Angela: were they? I don’t know that history.
[00:38:25] Jesse: I, I think so. Yeah. I, there were, um, the reason why there are some Asians in like Latin American countries, if I remember properly is cuz they had some kind of like.
[00:38:34] Jesse: Job exchange situation. Cause a lot of the, a lot of those countries in, in south America were I think either were, or are still oil countries. So they needed like highly skilled labor or something like that interest. That’s how they ended up there. Something
like
[00:38:49] Angela: that. Or, you know, I didn’t know any
[00:38:50] Jesse: of that.
[00:38:51] Jesse: It could be wrong. There’s some there’s, it’s definitely some kind of labor exchange what industry and what for like it’s. Yeah. I’m not sure if it’s very similar to how they brought Chinese people over for railroad stuff though. yeah. All right. So I think that we can move on over to the fortune cookie because we always like to end on a sweet treat.
[00:39:12] Jesse: And we’re gonna ask Angela to tell us what her future naming plans naming framework looks like and how she will be considering names for her future legacies. Legacy legacy.
[00:39:30] Angela: Yes. Well, it’s not that complex since I haven’t thought that much about it, but okay. We, we talked about it in the kids episode, though for the English name.
[00:39:39] Angela: I think it definitely needs to be something that can be pronounced in English in Spanish, so that it’s easy for you knows. Side. Um, so not Jesse yesy yes.
[00:39:52] Jesse: I’ve heard also Kessie yeah. Kessie Nope,
[00:39:56] Angela: no, thanks. No something that’s like, you know, could be both, um, like my name. Okay. Um, and then the Chinese name let’s be real you and I don’t know shit about you.
[00:40:08] Angela: Chinese and meanings. So I’m, I’m gonna, um, off offshore that to either my parents or, you know, a fortune teller, like whatever they want to. Yeah. Um, as long as like, they think it’s a good name, I think that’s sufficient to me.
[00:40:27] Jesse: I think honestly, a fortune teller makes a lot of sense, uh, because we don’t really know yeah.
[00:40:32] Jesse: Much about Chinese names. And the other thing is that there’s always this kind of. as an ABC, you’re always like kind of, I illegitimate in a way for the people who are like living there, but if you have a legitimate name, you seem less distinct. People will not notice as much. And I think that’s part of the reason why, why, uh, fortuneteller also makes sense.
[00:40:53] Jesse: Hey,
[00:40:53] Angela: and actually if, if the policy is still in place, because the reason I have dual citizenship is that even though I was born in America at the time, My mom said, if you registered your baby in Taiwan under one year of it being born, then it could get dual citizenship. So since the names aren’t chosen until after you’re born, since you need the date and hour and all that stuff, I guess we could theoretically name, you know, the Chinese name after it’s born in Taiwan with a fortune teller and then register that so that they have that citizenship.
[00:41:31] Angela: Hmm, write us in, tell us what you think, because I mean, not everyone who listens to the show is Asian, but a lot of you are Asian American or Asian something. Um, I’m sure what we talked about today is not distinct to just Chinese speaking people, because most Asian, you know, immigrant families name their kids, both.
[00:41:51] Angela: Names the original language and English. So write us in about your experience with having two names, whether that was a positive, negative, neutral experience for you growing up, how it kind of affected you. Um, or if you even know what your name means since we. Definitely didn’t write us in at tell us where you’re from@gmail.com and come back next week, because we’ll have another episode for you then.