Note: Transcript fully created by automated AI
[00:00:00] Angela: Hey everyone. I’m Angela Lin
[00:00:02] Jesse: And I’m Jesse Lin. And welcome back to another episode of, but where are you really from this week? Angela is joining us again from somewhere outside of the. Is it still Korea at this point in time? Or did you actually make it to Japan?
[00:00:19] Angela: I am still in Korea. Japan is still closed to tourists that are not on tour groups.
[00:00:26] Angela: That is the latest. As of today, June 9th. They’re letting people on like highly chaperoned, basically. Big brother style tour groups are the only ones allowed in right now.
[00:00:40] Jesse: Like the Fukushima radiation zone. You must say in this van, we just drive you around. . Yeah.
[00:00:45] Angela: Um, I mean, maybe ,
[00:00:49] Jesse: so if you guys haven’t into this episode, we’re just gonna be talking to Angela about her travels, how she’s enjoyed it so far, what she’s learned, highlights and all of that.
[00:01:00] Jesse: And again, I’m going to be your interviewer out of sunny, California. So you are still in Korea currently. You’ve been there for two months, two, three months.
[00:01:13] Angela: Um, so actually it’s probably been like a month and a half. Okay. I landed April 27th. It
[00:01:20] Jesse: just seems like a time war, but I feel like you’ve been there forever.
[00:01:24] Angela: yes, I do feel like I’ve been here forever as well. And because I’ve been to many cities since I’ve been here in the month and a half, so it’s not just like, I haven’t just been in Seoul
[00:01:34] Jesse: this whole time. Yeah. Nice. Have you picked up any Korean?
[00:01:39] Angela: Um, it’s actually just like a little disgraceful. How little Korean.
[00:01:43] Angela: I know, I tried really hard guys. It was. Before I got here, I was like, oh, it’d be really helpful to know some Korean or at the very least to learn the alphabet, because I’d heard that the Korean alphabet is like relatively easy to learn. Um, cuz it’s, it’s not that many characters. So I did do that on Duolingo and I’m not perfect.
[00:02:04] Angela: With it, because frankly their like pronunciation is really difficult. it’s like there are a lot of like, really minor differences in how some things are pronounced. That like sound the same in my head, but to them are not the same. Um, but yes, I did learn the alphabet. So at least I can like read, um, names of things, but I don’t know what they say.
[00:02:28] Angela: Um, so no, I don’t speak any Korean. I feel really bad. All I really know is hello. Thank you please. This please, which I don’t think is the same as just saying, please in general. um, and that’s about it. I just say thank you like a million times a day and that’s, that’s kind of all I got. Um, and then I use Google translate app, which is for the camera it’s actually been working.
[00:02:56] Angela: Oh yeah. The like, that’s like really helpful. . Yes. Yes. So like for menus and stuff, a lot of menus here are like only in Korean. So then I’ll use the camera to translate it and then. Either we’ll just point to it and be like this thing, or I I’ll read it in Korean because I can read the characters. Um, but yeah, without the camera app, I’d be screwed, I think.
[00:03:22] Angela: Wait,
[00:03:22] Jesse: so you can pronounce the
[00:03:23] Angela: characters. Yeah. I mean, I don’t think I’m pronouncing them like totally. Right. But like, if there’s a menu with the words and I’m just trying to say it, they like get it, you know what I mean?
[00:03:33] Jesse: Okay. I mean, better than not,
[00:03:35] Angela: they, I learned the alphabet. Yeah. Okay. Sweet. Exactly it.
[00:03:39] Angela: Nice. Yeah. Yeah. That’s all I got. Um,
[00:03:41] Jesse: you were the last time we talked. I think you said you were going to judge you island. How was that?
[00:03:48] Angela: J U’s awesome. TVH we just got, so I’m in Busan right now where everyone did not get turned into zombies. Um, I was in JSU island up until a week ago though. So I got here last Friday to Busan and we were in JSU for two weeks and we were there.
[00:04:07] Angela: Uh, one of the two weeks with my friend Lindsay from high school, she came to visit us for like the last days of soul and then for a week in Jiu. Um, Ji’s awesome. It’s basically like, it’s like the Hawaii of Korea, so it’s like an island off of Korea and it’s like more rural. They have. You can find, you know, like luxury hotels and stuff, just like you can in Honolulu, for example, in Hawaii, but you can also find more just like, kind of back country things.
[00:04:41] Angela: So there’s just. It’s really laid back and there there’s, it’s like Hawaii. There’s like we hiked a volcano, like a dormant volcano, and there’s like, yeah, they have these, um, they have these statues on the island that they’re known for that are kind of everywhere. It’s almost, it’s like the Easter island statues, but of Jew
[00:05:03] Angela: Um, so there’s just like, there’s just like that island vibe. and there’s a lot of really cute cafes, but that’s kind of everywhere in Korea. Um, but I guess the difference being that in soul, one of the reasons why I still know no Korean really is because compared to Japan, um, or like no one tries to speak English with you, even if they know some English in soul, because there’s so many young Korean people, they all know English.
[00:05:35] Angela: Some extent. So they, even if it’s like really bad English, they are more willing to like, try to communicate with you with their broken English. So it’s like enough for us to get by. But then in JSU it was like, yes, there’s some young people working these places, but it’s a lot of old grandmas and grandpas essentially.
[00:05:57] Angela: And so they don’t know any English. So it was definitely like a lot more like. Uh, yeah, pointing at stuff and like, hoping it works out because it, yeah, there was, it was not very English friendly. It was still like really cool, but not very English friendly there, you know,
[00:06:15] Jesse: sometimes pointing is sufficient.
[00:06:19] Jesse: what were these? Wait, what are these like rural activities that you were talking about in judge island? You’re like not luxury hotels, but more rural. Just like the
[00:06:31] Angela: adminis. Oh, no, I’m not, I’m not saying that it’s like rural activities. I’m saying that like, environment is more rural. Oh, okay. Got it. It was, yeah.
[00:06:41] Angela: It’s like, we, we stayed in a pretty quiet neighborhood cuz we were in an Airbnb. Um, and it was like, it’s kind of like Taiwan, you know, like especially Taiwan outside Taipei. Um, so like a little bit more kind of just. ramshackle is like, not the exact word I wanna say, but like, you know, it’s kind of like more rundown pastor pastoral
[00:07:03] Jesse: is the nice word for it.
[00:07:06] Angela: pastoral. I’m imagining like green Meadows. Exactly.
[00:07:09] Jesse: That’s not so nicer word.
[00:07:13] Angela: That’s not really it. Um, it’s no, it’s just, it’s just. I don’t know if anyone’s been to the countryside in Asia. It’s what that is. It’s just like, people live in more humble, you know, settings and that’s totally fine. But then you can also find the like more gentrified shit is just like where people are spending high money count and stuff.
[00:07:37] Angela: Um, but no, the activities were like, yeah, their, their biggest thing is, um, Mount Hosan, which is like, Largest, uh, dormant volcano. That’s part of there and it’s like, you hike it and it takes all day to hike. It’s like a, I mean, I think we did it faster than most blogs say it’s supposed to take, but if you go at like a leisurely pace, I guess it’s supposed to take like 10 to 12 hours, um, to go up and down.
[00:08:07] Angela: So we did it in like, I think, um, but yeah, we did that and then you can like go through like lava tubes, you know, it’s all like the, you know, what do you do in Hawaii? It’s like stuff that’s. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
[00:08:24] Jesse: Nice. So before we get into the travel questions, I think specifically when you started telling the listeners of the, I was gonna say the block, the podcast.
[00:08:38] Jesse: Sorry. okay. I’m just used to saying certain things. Okay. The podcast that you were going traveling, I think there was a lot of curiosity from a lot of the listeners, like financially, logistically, emotionally, philosophically, how you were gonna handle all of the, the work around traveling. So do you want to, I guess, just give us a rundown of like, how you’ve kind of arranged everything, maybe like the ins and outs and.
[00:09:07] Jesse: Made it work from, with the planning and like probably the money perspective is like where most people will have their heads at.
[00:09:14] Angela: Yeah. Um, well we wanted to live abroad in Asia for a while now. Like we, I. We had planned to do this year abroad, like pre pandemic, like that’s that’s as early as when we were talking about it, we had always said like, um, basically from the time we get married, it would just be like, we wouldn’t have a honeymoon.
[00:09:37] Angela: We would just go to this year in Asia and then come back to the us and. Final place to settle down, blah, blah, blah. So that was always the plan. And it was only because of COVID that it got pushed out because obviously our wedding got pushed out and then like actual travel capabilities got pushed out because all the borders everywhere were closed.
[00:09:58] Angela: Um, so we had just been kind of waiting like indefinitely for borders to open. and we had always wanted to actually spend most of the year in Japan because Ramon loves Japan. I, I like Japan a lot and we had lived there, um, for a few months previously. So that was the original plan was like, Japan will be the, the main place.
[00:10:21] Angela: And then we also wanted to spend some time in Korea sometime in Taiwan. We’re open to hopping around to different parts of Asia, but it was gonna be like largely Japan. So basically, as I already mentioned, Japan is still closed. Um, they’re like open. I think if you Google headlines right now, they’re very generous.
[00:10:43] Angela: In describing the situation where they’re like, Japan’s opened a tourist again, and it’s just not true. It’s like, it’s really only open to people that are signed up for these like very distinct tours that they can track exactly where you are. And they’re being super strict. Like. I think locals don’t necessarily have to wear masks, but they’re saying foreigners like have to wear masks 24 hours a day, essentially.
[00:11:09] Angela: And if you are caught not wearing a mask or not following like hand sanitizing or whatever other procedures, they have the right to like deport you essentially. So they’re being like very strict. Yeah. Super strict on that. Um, and they have not yet opened to just like general tourism. so we can’t be in Japan.
[00:11:28] Angela: Uh, so we’ve definitely been in Korea longer than we anticipated to be staying here. I think in our heads, we’d always said like, oh one month in Korea would be like pretty dope because we watch a lot of Korean content now. So we were both like more hyped to go anyway, but I don’t think we thought we’d be here more than a month.
[00:11:48] Angela: Um, it just kind of worked out that way because Korea was the first. Major Asian country to like totally open its borders. And by Asia, I mean, east Asia, Southeast Asia has been open. I think for some, some time, like you can go to Thailand or Vietnam and whatnot. Um, but I guess our proximities were like as close to Japan as possible was what we were thinking.
[00:12:12] Angela: Um, and Korea opened on April 1st. So we got in the end of April. Um, so that’s kind of how, like the thought process. Was working out and we were like, oh, we’ll just like, wait in Korea until Japan opens, because then it’s only a two hour flight to get into Japan, as opposed to waiting in the us where it’s gonna be a 13 hour flight to get to Japan.
[00:12:33] Angela: You know? So, um, that was the thinking around this year. Um, financially, honestly. So the thing is I quit my job, right. Like a while ago now I quit in. I think my last week was like, no, November last year. Um, and so it’s not like it’s not necessarily that I’ve been like saving up for this year abroad. I think I had been like saving up to quit my job in general.
[00:13:07] Angela: Um, so I, I didn’t necessarily say, like, I would only take this trip if I’ve hit like this milestone from dollar standpoint. I think it was more just like, I. Comfortable enough with what I have banked in savings and investments that I’m willing to already leave my job. So if I’m then spending a year abroad in a place with a standard of living, that’s a lot lower than what we were.
[00:13:35] Angela: Spending in the us then I don’t really need to worry that much about if I’m going to be okay in Asia. So that’s kind of my rationale. I don’t, we don’t necessarily have like a budget. Per day, but we were just for shits and giggles, like thinking about how much money we’ve been spending every day. And honestly, I think people have this MIS per misconception about how expensive it is to be in Asia.
[00:14:05] Angela: Like especially Japan, people have. Thoughts of like, oh, Japan’s so expensive and we’re not in Japan right now. But like I said, we did live in Japan previously for a few months. Um, and I would say it’s similar to Korea in terms of like daily spend, um, in Korea here, honestly on a, on a daily average between Ramon and I, as two people, we send like a hundred dollars a day, which is nothing, you know, like a hundred dollars a day.
[00:14:34] Angela: Would get you like a brunch and like an Uber in San Francisco. You know what I mean? It was just like, compared to that, it’s, it’s just like, I don’t have to worry about the money necessarily because we were just spending an astronomical amount of money to just exist in the states, especially in San Francisco.
[00:14:56] Angela: So it’s not like a huge concern for us because. Airbnb wise also like you can, you know, it’s all up to you. Like you can spend $10,000 a month if you want on your Airbnb, but you can also do that with your rent if you’re really that ball in, but you don’t have to. Um, most Airbnbs that we’re finding are way cheaper than what our rent was in San Francisco.
[00:15:21] Angela: So again, it’s like we’re saving thousands of dollars on living and then we’re saving a ton of money on. Daily expenditure. So I really, I don’t have this like tight budget that I’m going after. I’m just like, let’s just be reasonable with what we spend. And like, things are honestly cheap enough here that if you’re not going to like fancy restaurants every day, you’re gonna be fine.
[00:15:46] Angela: Like. Uh, really practical example is we, we went to this ramen restaurant. That’s like two door sound from our Airbnb, um, this week. And it’s like really good, like really high quality, but it’s not like a fancy place, just like, you know, it’s a nice, it’s a nice casual kind of like sit down. Um, it was 9,001, which right now with the like us conversion rate, it’s like $7.
[00:16:14] Angela: For bowl of ramen. So like, if you can eat meals for under $10, like, what do you have to worry about? You know what I mean? So that, that’s kind of where the financial, um, aspect is coming from. It’s not a tight budget that I’m keeping to is more just like realistically, once you fly over here, cuz the flight is obviously expensive to like fly to Asia, but once you actually get here, Your Airbnbs and your daily expenditure compared to if you are living in somewhere very expensive, like San Francisco or New York, you don’t have to worry about your budget because you know, you’re gonna be spending a lot
[00:16:49] Jesse: less.
[00:16:51] Jesse: Nice. So, I mean, it sounds like you had like a rough idea of where you wanted to go and not like a very strict schedule. So understanding. The cost of living is much lower than where you were. You just felt really comfortable making, making the jump for it with the both of you. I think that totally makes sense.
[00:17:09] Jesse: And I also, um, at the risk of sounding semi-tone death, because I know that we are making a certain level, well, we are in a certain income level bracket, but my friends and I have been making this joke. That’s. When we make bad decisions with money, as in like just excessively go to events or drinking or whatever, the joke is always that, you know, money will always come back around again.
[00:17:35] Jesse: And it’s kind of true. Like, you can always make more money later on, but you can’t really buy the time back that you didn’t use to do something that you really wanted to do.
[00:17:46] Angela: Yeah. A hundred percent. And I will add a, a few more things. One is like, obviously great point, like our. Income bracket or whatever.
[00:17:56] Angela: Our, our nor baseline standard of living is at a certain place. So we are, that’s kind of like where I’m speaking from, but I I’ve lived that life too, where like, uh, I was really poor, you know, like, uh, when we were doing study abroad, I did study abroad Trice. In college. So like, I was really poor back then, you know, it was like, oh, let’s take this $10 Ryan air flight, where I can only have like a backpack and then stay at this janky hostel where there might be bed bugs, you know, I’ve, I’ve done all of that.
[00:18:26] Angela: So I like, I know what that life is like too. And I will say, I think there’s a balance. So. honestly, if you wanna come here and you just wanna like maximize your dollars and you wanna do things, but not spend money on like food or whatever, if you really wanted to, you could buy 80 cent only gear and eat that for every meal.
[00:18:50] Angela: You know what I mean? Those little rice balls, the Japanese rice balls, they sell them in the convenience stores that are made like fresh daily for what. 1001, which has like 80 cents and it’s is the same in Japan. They were sold for like, you know, a thousand yen or whatever, which is like the dollar or 90 cents or whatever.
[00:19:11] Angela: So like, if you really wanted to, you could spend like less than $5 on food every day, if that’s not your priority so that you have more money to like go see sites or whatever that costs money with tickets and whatnot. So there are definitely like different things you can do to like maximize whatever is important to you.
[00:19:31] Angela: Um, it’s just like what we are in this place where I could eat, not convenience store food, but still have it be like cheap enough. Like honestly, I think most places, if you are just having a norm normal meal, not a like super touristy, you know, beachfront type place you can get between between seven to $12 for a.
[00:19:54] Angela: it’s it’s so cheap.
[00:19:55] Jesse: That’s pretty good, honestly. Yeah. Yeah. All right.
[00:19:58] Angela: Well, oh, and sorry. One more thing I will say, um, is, is just like, Another like O obvious, given that I’m kind of overlooking here is that we have the flexibility to do this because we are both remote work, friendly people. Um, I understand that it’s like a lot harder for people who have stricter jobs in terms of like geography.
[00:20:22] Angela: Like they demand that you’re in the office, you know, couple days a week or all the time or whatever. um, so that’s, that’s definitely like a context that I can’t overlook. If you don’t have that flexibility, it’s definitely gonna be a lot harder. Um, but I will say if you like really wanna do something, I think you can make it happen because especially now with the world, having changed with COVID in terms of like remote work, if your current job doesn’t let you do that, get a new job.
[00:20:52] Angela: I mean, easier said than done, but like, there are so many jobs now that are remote friendly. If your priority is to live abroad for a year, I am sure that you could find a job that would allow you to do that, whether it’s actually based in Asia or like allows you to work from anywhere, as long as you are willing to work weird hours, it really just depends on like what your priorities are.
[00:21:15] Angela: And, um, how much of a fire you have within you to make that happen? Uh, because I keep alluding to like this time that we lived in Asia, in Japan previously, I made that happen. It was not given to me as an opportunity. I was working at a tech company that did not allow remote work. And I positioned myself in a way where I convinced them to let me work from Japan for two years.
[00:21:40] Angela: Uh, sorry, not two years, two months.
[00:21:43] Jesse: I was like, you should still be there then.
[00:21:45] Angela: You be stuck there? I ain’t no. Um, God, no, uh, for two months. And it was, it was not easy to convince them, but if you’re, if you’re looking for like a short term thing and there is like, I don’t know, you have like, A a local team that you sometimes work with, or you have like clients there, or I don’t know what there are many different ways, but like, if you can position why you would bring value to that situation to be there, there are ways that you could like convince your current situ your current boss to like, let you be there for a short stint.
[00:22:23] Angela: If you’re not looking for like a big leap of. Changing jobs or whatever, I’m just saying it’s not impossible. It just obviously like depends on how much you are going to put into it, to like, make that happen. If you’re not currently in a situation where you could just live and work anywhere.
[00:22:43] Jesse: Yeah. I will second that I I’ve gotten lucky a few times, but also like I pushed for certain things certain times and like, Work, like it’s not gonna fall into your lap.
[00:22:53] Jesse: So like the times that generally I’ve traveled for work, like I pitched my boss that idea using like my own time, because I really wanted to do that. Um, so trade offs, right? Like sometimes it’s juice is worth the squeeze. If you really want to do it, if you want to do it another route just by taking vacation.
[00:23:11] Jesse: That’s also cool. Um, but yeah. All right. Was that all of your travel? okay. Sweet. Um, I guess, I guess, I guess since you, well, I’m sure you have like, way more, but we’ll save it for the socials for the clips, packing tips, beauty tips, K beauty. Um, so now that you’ve been traveling for like a month and a half or even longer, I guess since you’ve been basically digitally abroad for like the better half of the year, do you still have the travel.
[00:23:45] Angela: lost. Um, I wouldn’t say I have the travel. Bug it’s different. I think once you’re in a place where you’re constantly traveling, so I have only been in Asia for a month and a half, but I have been homeless. I mean, if you wanna put it the most like crude way, I’ve been homeless in terms of like, I don’t have a permanent residence, um, since last may.
[00:24:10] Angela: So for over a year. So I’ve been living, you know, a place to place like Airbnb to Airbnb, different cities for over a year. Um, I think when you’re in that kind of state, It’s not necessarily the same thing as saying you have the travel bug, because I remember that feeling where it’s like, oh, I haven’t been traveling in like a long time.
[00:24:28] Angela: I’m like dying to go to my friend’s wedding in Thailand, or like, to this, you know, vacation I’ve been saving up for, for like a year or whatever. It’s not the same as that. It’s more just like, you’re trying to maximize what you’re getting out of your every day, knowing that you’re getting to like see different things every day.
[00:24:49] Angela: So, and. Yes, we are and still waiting for and anticipating Japan opening up. So from that respect, we both are still like really excited for, and like anticipating the Japan experience. But, uh, no, I wouldn’t say I have the travel bug in terms of like, oh, I can’t, I can’t wait. It’s more just like, I’m here.
[00:25:12] Angela: Like let, let’s like do the thing, you know? Hey listeners, wondering how you can support us. The biggest way is by increasing our visibility by following us on Instagram at where are you from pod on TikTok at, but where are you really from subscribing to our YouTube channel under, but where are you really from podcast rating and reviewing us on apple podcasts and telling your friends.
[00:25:35] Angela: The more people we can get to listen to the show, the more we can continue spotlighting different perspectives and stories. And if you feel so inclined, we’re also accepting donations@buymeiacoffee.com slash where are you from? Thanks. Y’all
[00:25:50] Jesse: got it. Well, you haven’t made it to Japan yet, but I wanted to ask you, like, if you got kind of a certain feeling being in Korea versus Japan and I mean, not.
[00:26:02] Jesse: Like usually once I, for example, when I go back to Taiwan the first few days, I’m like, Ooh, I feel so like outsider. Right? Like you’re like acclimating to the surroundings. And then like about like day three or day four, I’m like, okay. I’m like, I feel at home now. And it’s a really nice feeling. So like, and your travel so far, have you reached that anywhere?
[00:26:24] Angela: Yeah. Um, well your question started with Korea versus Japan. So I’ll try to hit on that too, but yes, I did have a, a very distinct kind of like transition. Um, so the first. You’re right. Three days. It was three days for me. Um, the first three days in Korea were pretty rough for me to be honest. Um, I do think there’s a difference when you are coming to a place for vacation as like a short stint versus like knowing that you’re gonna be living there.
[00:26:57] Angela: Um, for like a longer period of time, I think when it’s vacation, it’s really easy to come to a place. And just especially Americans we’re so like obnoxious, right? Like just be the obnoxious Americans stereotype. And just like, I don’t speak the language. I’m just gonna speak English and like be obnoxious.
[00:27:15] Angela: And I don’t care about like the local manners and rules or whatever. I’m just here for like 10 days. I’m just gonna maximize my fun. Um, I think it’s really easy to be in that mindset when you are just on vacation. , but when you know, you’re gonna be there for like an extended period of time, I think it’s not uncommon.
[00:27:35] Angela: And it’s definitely common for me to feel like I have some sort of, to feel like people have expectations of me to like, Be a little bit more chill, you know, and integrated and like try to fit in as much as possible, given your capability with language barriers and whatnot. Um, so the first three days I was pretty shook.
[00:27:56] Angela: I? Um, well, number one, I had like really bad jet lag. I think age really. Changed things because I don’t remember ever having jet lag more than one day where it was like, I remember I would be like, okay, if I just power through the first day and like force myself to sleep at the normal local time, I’ll be fine the next day.
[00:28:16] Angela: And this was the first time where it was like, it took three days. Like I was wrecked those three days where I just could not like be awake at the proper times. And I was just like, so cranky and like stressed out because I. Sleep properly. Um, and then. all these things were stressing me out because I had this experience in Japan right.
[00:28:41] Angela: Where I felt a stronger pull to like conform. Um, I think Japan is known for that, right? Like society is very much about like, Conform a tea. Yeah. Don’t stand out and like, just like do what everyone else is doing. Um, so I felt, I remembered that from Japan and I kind of assumed that Korea would be the same.
[00:29:03] Angela: So I think I felt really pressured to like, try to like, not stand out and like to fit in. And, um, I felt really embarrassed that I couldn’t speak any Korean because. Especially, we, you have to wear masks everywhere still, like not outdoor, but indoor. Um, but at the time when we got there, it was everywhere, even outdoor.
[00:29:23] Angela: You still had to wear mask. Um, so like walking around me and Ramon with a mask, especially, you can’t really tell what kind of Asian I am. Right. You’re like, oh, she’s Asian. So she must be Korean. So they would start talking to me in Korean and I’d feel really like embarrassed because we like, fuck, I don’t know.
[00:29:39] Angela: Sorry. Like no English. Um, . And so I felt like a lot of shame for that. And then there were things like, you know, how we were taught, like you don’t leave food on a plate, right? Like, so just fucking finish it because it’s like ungrateful or it’s a bad look or it’s like a waste of money or whatever. So I was also like forcing myself to like, finish all the food that we’re ordering because.
[00:30:05] Angela: The portions in Korea are a lot bigger than I expected them to be like, they’re honestly, Western portions. Um, so like we over ordered a few times at a couple places because based on the prices, we thought it was like a lot less food. Uh, we were sorely mistaken, so I felt all this like pressure to like, not, uh, not embarra, I guess.
[00:30:29] Angela: Ourselves. And, and the chef at the restaurant by like not finishing the food, there were just all these things I was doing in my own head. And then also there were things like, um, you know, in Asia, the motorcycles and cars just like, come ride up to you. Like while they’re driving, like basically as long as they don’t hit you, that is the way they drive.
[00:30:52] Angela: And I was not used to that. I’ve experienced it in Taiwan and, and stuff previously, but it’s been a long time. So I was getting really stressed out because I was like, oh my God, this car is about to hit me or like this motorcycle’s about to hit me. And so I was just like, yeah, there was a lot of like stress factors.
[00:31:10] Angela: And then I think it took, yeah, the first, like half a week or whatever. And then after that I started acclimating and then I realized, especially all those like pressure. Um, don’t really exist and I’m just like inventing them, um, because Korea and Japan are actually quite different from that respect.
[00:31:29] Angela: Korea actually is not that much about conformity. Like, yes, there is a, a certain level of that still, but there’s a lot more like leeway, I think in terms of like you just being a, your own person. other little things is like, Japan is a very like quiet. Country. I feel like, like people don’t like talk loudly or whatever, and Koreans are a lot more like boisterous.
[00:31:57] Angela: So even when they’re not drunk. So like, you hear like girls like loudly laughing and like CA you know, talking and gossiping and whatever. And it was just like, oh, this is, this is different. Like, it’s less like stuffy, formal, I would say, which is a lot of times what it can feel like in Japan. Um, so, so, yeah, anyways, uh, Yeah.
[00:32:20] Angela: I put a lot on myself. I think those first few days that were not necessary.
[00:32:26] Jesse: No, I’m sorry. It’s anxiety girl. Just get some Xanax.
[00:32:32] Angela: Loles I, well, I, I think a lot of it comes from like what we talked about with, um, with a couple of guests about kind of the like frozen culture, like the idea of a culture, your concept of it.
[00:32:49] Angela: Yeah. Yeah. I, I had all these like concepts of what Asia in general and Korea, because I’m here was going to be like, in terms of what people would expect from me. And then I got here and I was like, no one expects that from me. This is just me, like with a really outdated version of what this culture is supposed to be like.
[00:33:10] Angela: So, yeah.
[00:33:11] Jesse: So you mentioned like when you were wearing mask people couldn. If you were a Korean or not. So how good were the Koreans at clocking a, whether you were a Korean or not, and B if they clocked that you weren’t Korean, were they good at figuring out like what kind of Asian you were?
[00:33:31] Angela: Um, okay. So I think there’s kind of two things.
[00:33:35] Angela: I think that in Asia, in general, um, it’s not necessarily that they think you are. their nationality. It’s that they assume you can at least speak the language if you’re Asian and in their country. So I don’t actually think everyone who saw me thought I was Korean. Um, especially cuz I’m really dark and like everyone’s really pale here.
[00:34:03] Angela: So like, Naturally. There’s probably a little bit of like, I’m confused by her. Um, but the default is to assume, even if you’re not, they are Asian. If you are in their country, you probably are like, I don’t know, working here or studying here or whatever, and like, no, their language more so than like, they have no expectations of Ramon, right?
[00:34:25] Angela: Like, because visually he is not Asian. Um, so it’s. Yeah. I, I don’t know that. They’re always assuming I’m Korean. I think maybe with the mask now more, they, they are doing that because they really can’t see any of my other features besides my eyes. But I think it’s more just like an assumption of the language, at least.
[00:34:47] Angela: Um, and this is something I think we talked about in the 4th of July episode, which is going to be the one right after this, uh, next week, but we prerecorded it and I kind of gave a preview, which is like, I don’t think Asians and Asia think necessarily about what kind of Asian you are necessarily like it’s, if you speak English, like if you are obviously American, for example, I think that is actually what they think of you more as, than whatever your ethnicity is.
[00:35:25] Angela: So like, I, you. They they’d always like, try to talk to me in Korean and then I’d be like, oh, sorry, English. You know, I tried to like pass by as much as possible because sometimes they say very similar things where I’m just like, I can just pretend we can just pretend like I know what you’re saying to make everyone feel more comfortable.
[00:35:43] Angela: Like, you know, we’ll come in. yeah, well coming to a restaurant and, uh, you know, they’ll say like welcome in Korean. And then I’ll flash like two for like two people and then, or no, they’ll say something which I assume is how many people and then I’ll flash a two, and then they’ll say like, oh, sit wherever you want.
[00:36:01] Angela: Or like, sit here, you know, they’ll gesture. And then I’ll just like nod and then we’ll just walk over and I’ll just pretend right. Because like, it makes everyone feel more comfortable if it’s just. Seamless thing. And then I only break it when it has to be broken, which is then if they like start asking me actual things, when we sit down and then I’ll be like, oh, sorry, English.
[00:36:22] Angela: Um, yeah, but, oh shit. What was the question? like a
[00:36:27] Jesse: lot. It was whether or not people could clock if you were Asian at all. Oh. And if they were, uh, sorry. Yeah. And if they were able to like, what kind of.
[00:36:38] Angela: were you accurately? I think once I said English, like, they’re just like, oh, okay. And then, um, they just assume I’m American.
[00:36:47] Angela: And then, um, randomly Korea and Japan really love Spain. Like we don’t know why. So then Ramon will say like I’m from Spain and then everyone will be like, I love Spain. And then it’s a whole thing. So we just, because they
[00:37:02] Jesse: were part of the access of evil from the us in world war II. .
[00:37:07] Angela: Oh, oh, no, I’m
[00:37:08] Jesse: kidding. I don’t know.
[00:37:10] Jesse: I mean, technically they were was Franco Hitler, Japan,
[00:37:16] Angela: you know, I don’t know sorted. Yeah. But Korea is not part of that. And Korea loved. Spain too. I don’t know. Anyways, so they’re just like, they love Spain. And then I say from I’m I’m from the us and they just leave it at that. They’re not like, no, but like, why are you, you know, they don’t care about that kind of shit.
[00:37:33] Angela: Mm. Um, or like sometimes Ramon will offer it because I think he thinks they’re asking that. And I don’t really think they’re asking that. Um, so like sometimes in Japan, for example, back then he would say like, oh, she’s, she’s from Taiwan of. I’m not from Taiwan. I’d be like, yeah, my family is from Taiwan. I am from the us and they’d be like, oh, okay.
[00:37:56] Angela: so it it’s less of a thing I think because, and we can get into this if you want it to become a whole thing. But like, I think there is a very big difference when you are visibly the majority. and not a minority. Like there’s like, even if I’m not actually Korean or actually Japanese, because I’m Asian visually, I don’t stand out as much.
[00:38:20] Angela: So they care less, I guess, about the like difference that I bring with my actual ethnicity, as opposed to like Ramon or something. And I’d be like, oh, spare. And
[00:38:31] Jesse: it’s like, . Yeah. I mean, I guess that makes sense because they’re all closer. So the likelihood that they’ve. A Taiwanese person or like a Japanese or whatever is much higher than they would have met like a Spanish person or something like that.
[00:38:46] Jesse: But you preempted one of my questions because I was like, did you get seen as American? And I think it’s really interesting cuz you’re like, in my mind, when you were saying that, I was like, oh, there’s like a taxonomy now where it’s like, it’s not just like, it’s not by how you appear, but rather. Do you live in the west?
[00:39:01] Jesse: Do you live in the east? Okay, cool. Now you’re like this beneath that. Now I’m gonna like break out that hierarchy in, in that manner. That’s really, I, I guess I never thought about it that way, but that is also very congruent with my experience.
[00:39:16] Angela: I also think, um, Koreans, as opposed to Japanese, there’s a lot more, um, There are a lot more Korean Americans who moved back to Korea than I think Japanese Americans who moved back to Japan.
[00:39:31] Angela: So there’s actually a lot of Americans here. Like there are so unassuming, but like for example, we just like, we were in Seoul and there’s like a coffee shop that we went into and we were trying to find somewhere with plugs so that we could work. And this one young woman, like our age type of woman. Like on the phone or whatever.
[00:39:51] Angela: And then she saw us kind of struggling and then she spoke in like perfect American English and was like, oh, this is the only plug here. Sorry. Like, and so we’re like, oh, okay. But she was like on the phone in Korean, you know, it was like, there’s so many of those types of people here that I think. Um, the concept of being American, but Asian appearing is so normal for them that it’s not like, they’d be like, oh, you’re not really American because you’re not white.
[00:40:20] Angela: Like they, they know enough people that are like living in America that are American, but are Korean that it’s understandable that a different Asian could be American.
[00:40:31] Jesse: Yeah. Like your friend, uh, Sund. I, I, if I was in Korea, I would nev I mean, I. , I don’t know enough to clock her and be like, she’s not natively Korean, you know, so, but, um, it sounds like you didn’t get, uh, any trouble.
[00:40:44] Jesse: You don’t have any trouble to get people to talk to you. Was that your experience? Um, in Korea and how does that in Japan?
[00:40:53] Angela: What do you mean by get people to talk to me? Because I guess
[00:40:56] Jesse: that’s different. Well, so like, you know, like how certain cities have like a reputation where people like don’t want to speak to you unless you can speak the language.
[00:41:04] Jesse: So for example, like, I think Paris is always like top of mind, when you think about people who are like, not willing to engage, if you don’t know, like at least a smidge of the language and. I think New York also has that reputation where it’s like, people don’t want to talk to you. Did you get that feeling or do you, did you get that feeling where it’s like people were really open to like helping you, uh, helping you out having conversation?
[00:41:30] Angela: Um, well, okay. So I think I will separate like, I haven’t just made like random friends, for example, in Korea. So I wouldn’t go as far as to say, like, people are like, so open that they’re like, let’s become friends. I can tell you’re American and I wanna be your friend. Right. Um, I wouldn’t say that, but I would say in Korea, there is definitely a more willingness to engage with you, even if there’s a language barrier than in Japan, for example.
[00:42:01] Angela: Um, I think. it’s not okay. How do I explain this? Okay. With young people, I don’t sense any judgment when I can’t speak Korean, they it’s more just like, oh, okay. Like, let me just like reframe. Right. And like, I’ll talk to you again in like, whatever way we’re able to communicate. Um, with older people, like the AJU like they’re the like older ladies who are working in restaurants or like at a.
[00:42:32] Angela: Food market or whatever. I think there is a, a tinge of disappointment because like, I’ve, I’ve heard it a few times where they’re like, I, I, and I should know what this phrase is by now, but I know Korean is. Hang at least like he, right. Um, so they, they ask like, hung, blah, blah, blah. Basically, do you speak Korean?
[00:42:55] Angela: And then I’ll be like, no. And then they’ll be like, oh, you know, like a little bit of like, disappointment about it, but then we’ll like, figure, we’ll stumble our way through it because their English is usually not as good as like the young people, but it’s not like, they’re like, okay, now I’m gonna be like an asshole to.
[00:43:12] Angela: um, I think it’s slightly different than like Paris is a really good example, sorry for all the French stereotypes. But I did work for a French company and I did go to Paris for a week for work. So like, I, I did experience some of this, um, Yeah, their stereotype. Is that in, in France, there’s more of a looking down at you, right?
[00:43:29] Angela: If you can’t speak the language, I don’t think there’s a looking down at you here. I think it’s like, if anything, a slight disappointment of like, oh, like, I wish you did. Um, but there’s not like I’m not gonna talk to you anymore. I think sometimes though, if they really don’t speak any English, it can come off cold, but it’s not that they’re trying to be rude.
[00:43:50] Angela: They just like, don’t really know how to. Engage with you. So like I’ve noticed, for example, like they will barely say anything to us and just like throw topstick on the table and like, whatever, versus like, I see them talking to like Korean people in like a very gregarious, friendly manner. And I think if we weren’t Asian, , you know, I would take that a different way.
[00:44:12] Angela: Um, for example, like in Chinese restaurants, in the us, right? Like a lot of non-Chinese and non-Asian people can say, oh, those people are so rude. Right. The people who work in those restaurants they’re so like, CRAs and they don’t, there’s no like small talk and blah, blah, blah. Right. Versus like, we, we understand what that is.
[00:44:31] Angela: It’s like, they’re trying to be efficient. And like, they probably also a lot of them probably don’t know that much English yet. Anyway. So they’re just trying to like, you know, serve you in as efficient of a manner as possible. So that’s kind of how I see it with like some of these older Korean women that like, don’t speak any English and they’re.
[00:44:47] Angela: Being like, they’re not trying that hard with us. I think it’s more just that they, you know, they’re just trying to like, do what they can. Um, and I can tell because then when we are paying and we like, say goodbye, they’re like really gracious, then they’re like, oh, thank you know, thank you so much. And like, what, so it’s, it’s obvious that it’s more just like they’re we have a language barrier, so they’re just like doing what they can, you know?
[00:45:09] Jesse: Okay. So I guess we’ve learned a. A bit, a lot, a bit, a bit, a lot about Asia and Korea. Well, you haven’t done the whole thing yet, so we’ll have to check back with you when you made Japan. Um, but maybe just a few, just kind of like general travel questions about like maintaining your existing social life and stuff like that.
[00:45:30] Jesse: So how did you stay in touch with people? Like what are like the winning methods that you had to, to make yourself still, still feel connected to. Your friends at home? Uh,
[00:45:41] Angela: good question. I don’t think I’m like that. Good about that, frankly. Um, but I think just taking advantage of like the few hours that you do have an overlap with people is really important because the time zone is going to really mess with you once you are living on the other side of the world.
[00:46:01] Angela: So like, I am lucky in that. Asia is not as bad as like, I think it’s pretty bad when you’re trying to work. Like I remember working with Japan and India, um, when I was in San Francisco and that was like almost impossible because from my work day perspective, there’s very few hours of overlap. But when it’s just your like friends, you can text them at like 9:00 PM their time.
[00:46:27] Angela: It’s totally fine. Right. So like, I just try to maximize the amount of time. That exists in overlap to like send a text or sometimes I have been FaceTiming people or like quick call or whatever. Um, and just keeping them, I think. Up to date as much as possible so that it doesn’t seem like I just like blip off the the side of the earth.
[00:46:52] Angela: Um, but I, I don’t think I’ve been like that good about that, but honestly, I’m thinking back and I’m like, was I ever that good about that? I don’t know. It’s not like I was like calling my friends every day when I was in San Francisco either. So it’s just kind of like doing what I can when like something reminds me of them or like, I have a question for them or.
[00:47:09] Angela: Whatever, but like being mindful of the times and difference, because I have noticed that if you just text them at like a random time, that’s like 3:00 AM their time. A lot of times they don’t get a text back because then they’re like, they probably saw it at a weird time. And then they’re like, oh, now they’re asleep.
[00:47:24] Angela: And then they don’t text you back. And whatever, just make sure you text and called during like normal human hours for them work
[00:47:33] Jesse: or weird, weird hours for me because I keep weird. Um, yes,
[00:47:39] Angela: I will say the only thing that has been like hard is, um, therapy is difficult because they, they do work on like work hours.
[00:47:49] Angela: Right? So like, my therapist is like doing me a favor to take my calls as late as she does. She takes it at like 4:00 PM her time. I think she usually would not wanna take that late of a session. Um, but it’s like 8:00 AM for me. So I’m kind of. that’s kind of the earliest. I would want to be taking therapy because I don’t think I would be like in a good mindset if I like just wake up and blah, blah.
[00:48:12] Angela: So I, I think there are challenges with things where you have to work around like an actual, like work schedule. So other people’s work schedules. So just be mindful of that, but you can always make anything work. I think.
[00:48:28] Jesse: And final question before the close, they say that you don’t really ever truly know your partner until you travel with them.
[00:48:34] Jesse: Do you feel like you truly know your partner now?
[00:48:39] Angela: yes, but I think I’ve known him for a long time because we, we have been traveled. That’s true. That’s true. Yeah. That initial Japan two monther was our first like crash course. Oh yeah, because it was also, before we moved in together, it was such a thing. It was such a thing, cuz we were like, if we can’t live two months in Japan together, we cannot live together.
[00:49:03] Angela: Like in general so I would say that was the biggest like clash time where it was like I’m learning everything that annoys me about you and vice versa. Um, so yeah, I think I know everything about him by now.
[00:49:20] Jesse: I mean, you know. you have the, you, you know, the person with all the disclosures now. That sounds very great.
[00:49:28] Jesse: All right. Well, um, shall we move over to the fortune cookie clothes? Yeah, because we always like to end on a sweet treat. That last question I feel like was maybe a little difficult. So I am going to end on the very simple question, um, for the close, do you have a favorite moment from your time in Korea so far?
[00:49:50] Jesse: Huh? this wasn’t supposed to be a
[00:49:54] Angela: stuper yeah, it was not supposed to be, but, well, because we’ve done so many things, I feel like mm-hmm so I’m kind of like, what has been my favorite thing? I don’t know that I have like one favorite thing, because I think that moments that stand out are like food, food moments that of course stand out because that’s a lot of what we do is just eat really good food.
[00:50:17] Angela: Um, So I have a couple of those in my head, but I would say, uh, having Lindsay with us for a week was probably like one of my highlights so far, because it was just really, really nice to have one of my best friends with us and in a different country. Right. Because then it’s like an adventure that you guys are on and, um, I think it also like speaks to what we’ve talked about with like mental health, which is like, I love Ramon obviously, but we have only been spending time with each other for the last year, um, year plus.
[00:50:58] Angela: Because of COVID right. Um, with like stints with hanging out with people. But especially when we live on the road, we don’t see our friends that frequently. Um, so it was just really nice to have like a third energy come into our dynamic and like bring a lot of levity and stuff into situations and like a totally different perspective and like ideas to do things and like willingness to help and stuff like that.
[00:51:25] Angela: So, , it was just such a joy to have her with us, I think for that, that week and a half. Um, and I also think it helped in like, it helped kind of rejuvenate us too, in terms of like, by the end of it, I was like, oh, I’m really happy she came, but I’m ready for some like privacy again, in terms of like, just us two again, which is like a rare feeling when you are just always with only one person, you never feel like, oh, I just wanna be with you again.
[00:51:55] Angela: It’s like, I can’t stand being with you anymore. So it was, it was nice that like a week and a half could, could do all of. With, with our friend
[00:52:04] Jesse: work, shout out Bethy Lindsay . Yeah. all right. Well, thank you for sharing your travel adventures with us so far. I hope that Japan open Japan, anti one opens soon so that you guys can get in there and complete that the two and the three legs of your Asia trip.
[00:52:23] Jesse: Oh, thanks listeners. If you have any questions for Angela regarding her. Maybe you have recommendations, maybe you have other logistical, budgetary philosoph, philosophical questions for her about traveling. Feel free to write us in at tell us where you’re from@gmail.com or also DMS on any of the social.
[00:52:47] Angela: And, uh, come back next week because we’ll have our final episode of this batch, um, before we take a little break. Um, and yeah. And so then,